Always remember though that there is alot more to the newer VQ than just the IM. I'm not saying that it will or wont make more power, (or just shift the power band for the better) but the difference in power does not only come from the IM such as it did with the 95-99 DE vs. the 00-01 de-k.

 

I didn't mean the numbers. I meant the actual shape of the curve.

I know the heads are different as well as the cams.

 

Nice curves - any details about the setup of the car? And I see that the test was on a Dyno Dynamics dyno - that's quite a bit different than a Dynojet, isn't it? I think that the Alty IM has promise for me, anyway.

I managed to get the mounting plate made for the Pathy TB yesterday. Cut out a 4"x4" chunk of 1/4" 6061 AL and drilled and tapped the holes for the TB and a 3" hole in the middle, using a new TB gasket for the 2001 Pathy TB. The bolts are 8mm x 1.25 x 30mm long, with locking nylon nuts. That 6061 AL is tough stuff to cut holes in! The piece of 3" tubing I have slips right into the 3" hole and is ready for brazing in place... now I need to make a plate for the UIM inlet and cut off the OEM screws to mount a block-off plate. I'm going to make a brace for the TB to help support the weight off the plastic intake port. I still have tubing in the mail, so until I get the rest, this won't be welded up.

I made rough measurements yesterday of the SSIM presently mounted in my car and the Alty IM, and for the most part things are roughly the same, so I went ahead with the TB part of the work. The Alty plenum is longer, so I need to check hood clearance in my '99.

Still a bunch of work to do, but I feel OK about this project.


EDIT - tonight I plugged the holes in the '01 Pathy TB w/JB weld.
Did more measurements on the car and the '08 UIM. Things look compatible, but the TB mount will take some thinking - the 3" tubing I ordered will be here this week, so I can get this right.

 

Do you know what static timing the guy who used the whole engine ended up going with?

 

I cut some more aluminum and ABS plastic tonight. Got some photos of the progress to date - also a question - how do you get the shaft out of a 2001 Pathy TB? I've got it stripped down, but I don't see what has to come out ??? I'm going to cut down the shaft a bunch, and I already have sharpened the leading and trailing edges of the throttle plate.

PIX:

 

How long do you plan on making the neck on the tb adapter? The longer you make it, the more the power band shifts IIRC.

 

As for the TB, looks like you have to turn the rod to remove the tps indicator. Then remove the golden cap under the tps indicator. Then remove the rod.

 

It's going to be 4-5" long - enough to clear the cover over the left-side VIAS flapper. That long tube will be cut off, of course - but it makes for a great photo....

 

The pin is in there very tight, and the shaft has no side-to-side motion. The bearings are very good in this TB. The side with the cable attachments has one piece that seems to be welded to the shaft, so I assume that side must come out, but I hate to beat on it until I know what to do.

Maybe a fresh look tonight will help....

 

Any reason you're opposed to cutting the back of the shaft off and countersinking the holes in the plate? The guys in that link I sent you we're doing it with the shaft in place, might be easier.

 

I thought about it - but if I can get the shaft out, I could do a better job of shaving down the shaft. It would take a hacksaw blade down through the throttle bore to cut off the upper part, and still leave a sharp edge. I put Gorilla Tape on the bore, just to protect it from my grindings, but that would be messy.

Stupid shaft has some great bearings, too. We shall see.... at least I'm trying to open up the bore - that is one fat shaft!

 

Yeah the airflow calculations of shaving the shaft are undeniable, surprising more people don't do it.

I've heard of weird stories of idle problems when I was researching this mod, but it was usually on carbed engines and fly-by-wire. Cable+TPS makes it a little easier to compensate for.

 

Here's the link you had sent me - you're right, this is a serious gain in throttle body bore size. Maybe the "Pathy shaft mod" ???

http://sdbhost.com/cms/docs/TB6optimize.html



EDIT: If you assume the shaft is indeed 10mm, and it extends 70mm, that's 700sqmm. If the shaft can be reduced to an effective 5mm diameter, that's 350mm reduction in area. The effective stock bore volume is 3846sqmm minus the stock shaft area of 700sqmm, leaves an opening of 3146sqmm. Making the shaft smaller by 50% adds 350sqmm to the bore, equaling 3496sqmm bore area, for a net gain of 11% bore volume. I think it's worth doing....

 

Interesting, never thought about trimming the shaft on the TB.. I think I'll give it a shot on one of my spare ones.

 

Outstanding! Please take lots of pictures if you do - this could be a useful mod if it works out.

 

http://zilvia.net/f/tech-talk/305836...-assembly.html

Might help.

 

I still don't feel comfortable about completely stripping down the TB, so I decided to take a hacksaw to the shaft. Turned out to be pretty simple. I clamped the TB into a vise, took the blade loose from a hacksaw, slid the blade through the bore so the teeth were on top of the upper part of the shaft, and re-assembled the hacksaw, tie-wrapped the cable rotor thingie to the TB, and began hacking. A few minutes later, the upper part of the shaft was cut off. I set the blade on the vise with a bit in the chuck, used the bit to center each hole, and slowly counter-sunk each hole. I used a 5mm x 0.8 flathead screw and blue Permabond to re-attach the blade to the shaft, put the cable stuff and TPS sensor back on, and I'm done! Oh yeah, I also used a sandpaper drum or two to grind down the screws. It ain't beautiful, but it's done - and the bore is larger.... .


PIX:

 

Just wondering why not just bore out the tb opening and use a larger diameter blade

 

^ 100 bucks and this UIM can't accommodate for a larger TB bore.

 

"bam"s right - the UIM is limited to the stock bore (UIM measured 71mm - and the TB is 71.5mm), so making the bore bigger is out. Making the shaft smaller is the most immediate option. I have a couple of Q45 90mm TBs, and I can buy a new 80mm from eBay, but no reason I can see to do that...

???

 

but I thought you were bolting this up to a adapter and not the uim so it shouldn't matter right

 

That's right. But what reason is there to make the TB larger, then reduce the air path down to the 71mm of the UIM??? I'm going to use the stock MAF to start...

 

Hope everything works out!

Project looks really good in person.

 

You should remember this part, then..



No wonder I can't get anything done!



Quite a krew..... !!!

 

Yep, looking good!

 

Remember that guy Bernoulli? Considering you have the ability to gradually decrease the diameter of the piping from the TB to the IM inlet you could create and awesome venturi effect which (in your case) would allow any pre-TB stages of nitrous to be accelerated into the IM. The increase in flow would (at least according to the equation) lower the pressure post IM inlet and mix the nitrous and air much better (think carburetor in this case).

Might be worth considering.

 

I remember Bernie from college, and I think you're right, but.... I'm going to go up with this using the stock maf and 3" tubing all the way, so no point in testing those ideas now. Oh, and I'm going to step beyond the pre-maf nitrous and go to two stages of direct-port nitrous (with ethanol) for my spray. That's already in the works. No more Shark nozzles in the tube...

However, if this experiment works, and I finish the EU installation so I can tune, then I think that I can use a much larger maf, connection elbow, and 90mm TB to taper down into the 71mm intake port - and still tune for a decent idle. I think I can get a larger (say 3 1/2") aluminum tube and slice it open down one side, then bend the pipe to a taper (think ice-cream cone) to feed the IM port, as you described. Maybe...

 

The world famous 99 sammich

I'll take a look @ the stock 3.0 TB, I can always pick one up for like $5. Want to apply the concept that if it works on a 3.0 then it works on a landshark 3.5?

 

If you can make something work based on Bernie's principle on the RedDevil, then sure, I'll consider it - but use small words to describe what you did. Otherwise, I'll think your venturi effect applies to a 4-barrel carburetor, and you know I don't want a bubble in my hood.

 

I've modified the Pathy TB and created a mount for the TB, and aluminum-brazed everything together. I'll spread the photos out a bit.

Did you know that the stock '01 Pathy TB will not open all the way - see last photo in this posting, After all the hacking I've done on this TB, I went ahead and Dremeled off a piece on the cable spool and fixed that problem

 

 

 

All gasketed up and ready to go play !





Next job is to secure the mount for the two throttle cables....

 

 

 

This is a good place for a blow-out panel.

 

Now it's time to hack on fuel rails. Think I'll eBay an OBX set for experimentaion.

 

Looking good Harold!

 

I endeavor to persevere. And, yes, it actually looks pretty good, too.... How's your Purple Power doing? (new assigned nickname for the ride)

 

It's doing pretty good. Check out the times I ran in 4000+ DA on street tires.